Justyna Łuczaj-Salej’s visceral feature The Horse Tail screens at the Fall 2024 New Jersey Film Festival on Sunday, September 22. The film will be Online for 24 Hours on this date. Here is the interview I conducted with Justyna via the internet.
Nigrin: Your feature film The Horse Tail is a reworking of the Oedipus story set in modern-day rural Poland. Tell us about the why you decided to make this film and the process you went through to complete it.
Łuczaj-Salej: I was inspired to work on a script for a neo-noir film after watching Béla Tarr’s Damnation. I wanted to make a film about a femme fatale and a cursed love. At first I sculpted the characters one by one for other films, but then I combined them in The Horse Tail. Greek mythology has interested me since my childhood – depicting Jocasta as a femme fatale seemed to be an interesting challenge.
What I drew from Damnation was also a kind of a cursed place, which is as rotten as the lives of the people inhabiting it, where people are are connected by strong, toxic relationships – to be exact, all of them are connected to each other and to the place itself. I decided to set this film in southeastern Poland, in a 50 kilometer radius from my city. I wrote the script for a few specific locations in this area that I thought were unique and inspiring. I also wanted my film to include my favorite natural spaces. I wanted nature to be a character in my film as well.
The creation of The Horse Tail took ten years of my life. For about two years, I was writing the script, and then I spent four years actively trying to secure funding. Then came the filming, reshoots, the pandemic, and a very long editing process, until finally, in 2023, the film premiered at the Mammoth Lakes Film Festival. It truly was a very long period of my life.
I tried to create a kind of trance or hypnosis during the work on set. I didn't want the actors to act (which is why I preferred working with non-actors). I attempted to create conditions where the scenes would just happen, with a lot of improvisation. It was a very intense experience. We had a lot of different problems on set and even before we started shooting. All the changes and setbacks became part of the "living process" of making the film—I used them creatively.
This madness was possible thanks to my tireless determination, immense faith, and the favor of the Greek gods... but also, of course, thanks to my professor from the Film School, Mariusz Grzegorzek, who, as the head of Studio Indeks, believed in my project and decided to produce it.
Nigrin: You are also a painter, and it is amazing that so many of your images in the film could be paintings. Was that your intention? Did you want your film to have a painterly look?
Łuczaj-Salej: Initially, I wanted my film to have a mood similar to my paintings. The scenes I painted always feature strong, non-realistic lighting. For example, the sky is green or purple, and this light permeates everything else, creating color tensions. For production reasons, this wasn't fully achieved. The equipment and budget we had were quite limited. However, in post-production, we managed to slightly "infect" the light with a lemony, toxic tint. I like this effect; it helps to unrealize the reality. My film is like a dream, a somewhat bad but beautiful dream. There are also many "trance" sequences with red strobe lights or underwater greens.
My cinematographer, Gosia Szyłak, and I were also inspired by the world depicted in the works of painters like Neo Rauch and Tilo Baumgärtel. A world that draws from reality but introduces some disorder, unease, something that distorts, allowing in some unrealistic light or strange objects. For me, the main inspiration ultimately was a location near Jasło, a store with used items. This location greatly inspired me during the scriptwriting phase and later became the filmic kingdom of one of the characters—Hans. In this store, you can find objects from five years ago but also from forty years ago. They coexist and create a cohesive whole. I constructed the world and time of "The Horse's Tail" in a similar way. I really like Gosia Szyłak's cinematography. The softness, sensitivity of the camera, the air she can capture in a frame. While preparing the film, we kept telling ourselves that it should be somewhat "underframed," with the camera moving but gently, following the movement of actors, emotions. The film was also supposed to have something archaic, like from the times of Pasolini or Bresson. Focus on faces, simplicity.
Nigrin: Many of the locations in your film are amazingly beautiful and bleak. Where did you shoot your film? Were there any challenges shooting there?
Łuczaj-Salej: As I mentioned earlier, the film was mainly shot in the southeastern corner of Poland. Some of the most important locations were already familiar to me, and I wrote the script for these specific locations—such as the store with used items, barns, and some landscapes. However, it wasn't easy to find a town as dilapidated as we wanted. We had to compose it from several small towns in the Podkarpacie region. The main town was Jasło. My cinematographer and I traveled for a year looking for the perfect locations. We shot a few scenes in Slovakia. I really like Slovakia for its sleepy atmosphere. We filmed in Svidnik and Ladomirova. Svidnik matches the atmosphere of Jasło. It turned out that they are even partner towns. In both places, I feel like time stopped 30 years ago... which I consider positive. I don't like the intrusive revitalization that affects so many places in Poland. It's impossible to film there. In Jasło and Svidnik, there are many authentic places touched by time and decay. My cinematographer and I wanted to create a somewhat crumbling world where nature encroaches, with tall grass, wild trees, uneven pavement slabs, cracking concrete, and peeling plaster. There was no single ideal place, so we decided to create a collage of places with a similar vibe.
As for the challenges... the locations by the river were very difficult to access, and we had to transport equipment and people by tractor with a trailer across the river to the other side. The most challenging scenes, such as underwater shots with a horse, were filmed with just four people. Independently. It was risky. Some locations were also initially difficult to secure—like in the barns, where they were reluctant to let us film. I had to show immense determination to convince them that we wouldn't interfere with the farm's work—we had to adapt to their work cycle. It was similar with the store selling used items.
Nigrin: Your actors are terrific! Most are first-time actors. Tell us about them and how you discovered them.
Łuczaj-Salej: Choosing the right protagonists was crucial for me. The process of finding them was very long and complicated. For the main role of Oedipus—Maj, we organized many castings, but I was never satisfied. Returning from the last casting, I met my Oedipus on the street. However, my producer did not accept him, so it took me several months to convince him of my choice. Jocasta's face appeared to me on Facebook when one of my friends liked her photo, which is why it showed up on my wall. However, it took me two years to convince her to act in the film. During that time, I did many castings for this role, knowing that my Jocasta-Diana was already out there, but I didn't know how to persuade her to participate in the film. Finally, I succeeded! For the character of Hans, I decided to hire my favorite actor, Przemysław Bluszcz. I wrote this role for him. I wanted people in the film who didn't have to act, who simply were those people, who could bring their own energy, experience things in their way, but not perform.
From the beginning, I thought about introducing some form of "Greek chorus" into the structure. Initially, I had the idea to involve the famous fashion and perfume designer Thierry Mugler. Everything was on the right track, but our schedules didn't align. I remembered my brother's neighbor, who lived near the forest. He was perfect for the role of the so-called "Holy Fool," a village madman who speaks in metaphors, prophesies, and makes comments in a roundabout way. I liked Tomek's booming voice and the melody of his sentences—he always speaks as if he's saying something extremely important. He is a person with some intellectual disability, but at the same time very wise, with a vast knowledge, able to manage and, above all, deeply in love with nature, living in harmony with it. My film's narrator was supposed to be a kind of fairy-tale forest gnome. The lines I wrote for him are vulgar, earthy, sometimes hard to listen to. I still don't know where they came from... I entered a kind of trance, and such a character began to speak through me. I trembled and laughed while reading them. I also tried to find other texts, more poetic ones. We tried, for example, Hölderlin... but ultimately, my lines remained.
Nigrin: Tell us about the funding. Is it correct that the Polish Institute funded most of your film?
Łuczaj-Salej: Yes, we received a grant from the Polish Film Institute. And that was our only money. We worked on getting that grant for four years. We also had co-producers who contributed in kind—for example, the Łódź Film School provided us with some equipment. Student-interns from the school also worked on the set. That was a big saving. We lived in a region of Poland that is relatively cheap—so things like hotel accommodation and food were at least twice as cheap as in Warsaw. My cinematographer, actors, and I also earned very little. The most interesting investment of earned money was made by Anouchka, a ten-year-old girl playing Dagmara—she bought a Hucul horse mare, which already has a few offspring, so as a result of appearing in The Horse's Tail, she became the owner of several horse tails.
.jpg "New Jersey Film Festival Fall 2024 Filmmaker Interview with The Horse Tail Director Justyna Łuczaj-Salej!")
Nigrin: What do you hope audiences will take away after viewing your film?
Łuczaj-Salej: I certainly hope they will experience an encounter with art, with mystery, with an authentic experience. I hope it will be moving. The best term is the Greek "catharsis"—a shock and cleansing. Interestingly, so far, the best reception at a festival was in the USA.
Nigrin: Are there any memorable stories while you made this film or any other info about your film you would like to relay to us?
Łuczaj-Salej: The pre-production and production time was an incredibly beautiful period. Everything took place in stunning landscapes, under the late summer sun. We became a close-knit family of wanderers with the whole crew. We ate outdoors, bathed in the river, and lit bonfires. To this day, many memories remain—like when I almost completely fell into manure in the barn, when we ate pizza and drank wine while swimming in the river. The smell of barns became my favorite scent, although initially, it was unbearable.
One of the big challenges was filming the scenes with the tail floating in the river. We had three tails of different sizes. Depending on the needs, one was about 1 meter long, another 2 meters, and the last 3 meters. We moved the tails with a fishing line attached to a stick. There was no budget for special effects like this, so we had to do it in such primitive ways. Our friend Patrycja, the second set designer, did an amazing job creating them from real tails bought at a butcher's shop.
The Horse Tail screens at the Fall 2024 New Jersey Film Festival on Sunday, September 22. The film will be Online for 24 Hours on this date. Tickets are available for purchase here.
The 43rd Bi-Annual New Jersey Film Festival will be taking place on select Fridays, Saturdays, and Sundays through October 18, 2024. The Festival will be a hybrid one as it will be presented online as well as doing in-person screenings at Rutgers University. All the films will be available virtually via Video on Demand for 24 hours on their show date. VoD start times are at 12 Midnight Eastern USA. Each General Admission Ticket or Festival Pass purchased is good for both the virtual and the in-person screenings. Plus, acclaimed electronic music artist Jim Haynes will be doing an audio-visual concert on Friday, October 18 at 7PM! The in-person screenings and the Jim Haynes Concert will be held in Voorhees Hall #105/Rutgers University, 71 Hamilton Street, New Brunswick, NJ beginning at 5PM or 7PM on their show date. General Admission Ticket=$15 Per Program; Festival All Access Pass=$120; In-Person Only Student Ticket=$10 Per Program. General Admission Jim Haynes Concert Ticket=$25. To buy tickets go here: https://watch.eventive.org/newjerseyfilmfestivalfall2024
